03/15/2007 08:00 AM House STATE AFFAIRS
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HJR11 | |
| HB171 | |
| HJR6 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | HJR 11 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | HB 62 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 171 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HJR 6 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE STATE AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE
March 15, 2007
8:03 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Bob Lynn, Chair
Representative Bob Roses, Vice Chair
Representative John Coghill
Representative Kyle Johansen
Representative Craig Johnson
Representative Andrea Doll
Representative Max Gruenberg
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 11
Relating to the increased authority granted to the President of
the United States to federalize the National Guard of the
individual states without the consent of the governors; and
urging the United States Congress to take action to restore the
sovereignty of the individual states to regulate and command the
National Guard of the states.
- MOVED CSHJR 11(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 171
"An Act relating to the terms of legislators, the date and time
for convening regular legislative sessions, adoption of uniform
rules of the legislature and to certain of those rules, the date
for organizing the Legislative Budget and Audit Committee, and
deadlines for certain matters or reports to be delivered to the
legislature or filed; prohibiting bonuses for legislative
employees; and providing for an effective date."
- HEARD AND HELD
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 6
Proposing amendments to the Constitution of the State of Alaska
relating to the office of attorney general.
- HEARD AND HELD
HOUSE BILL NO. 62
"An Act providing for partial tuition assistance for families of
members of the Alaska National Guard; directing the adjutant
general to seek additional funding to support tuition
assistance; and providing for free hunting and sport fishing
licenses for active members of the Alaska National Guard."
- BILL HEARING CANCELED
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HJR 11
SHORT TITLE: STATE'S CONTROL OF NATIONAL GUARD
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) ROSES
02/28/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (H) MLV, STA
03/06/07 (H) MLV AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
03/06/07 (H) Moved Out of Committee
03/06/07 (H) MINUTE(MLV)
03/07/07 (H) MLV RPT 4DP
03/07/07 (H) DP: LEDOUX, FAIRCLOUGH, BUCH, ROSES
03/15/07 (H) STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106
BILL: HB 171
SHORT TITLE: ACCOMMODATE 90-DAY SESSION
SPONSOR(s): RULES
03/01/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/01/07 (H) STA
03/06/07 (H) STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106
03/06/07 (H) Scheduled But Not Heard
03/15/07 (H) STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106
BILL: HJR 6
SHORT TITLE: CONST. AM: ELECTED ATTORNEY GENERAL
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CRAWFORD
01/25/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/25/07 (H) STA, JUD, FIN
03/15/07 (H) STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106
WITNESS REGISTER
JOSH APPLEBEE, Staff
to Representative Bob Roses
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented HJR 11 on behalf of
Representative Roses, prime sponsor.
RYNNIEVA MOSS, Staff
to Representative John Coghill
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: On behalf of the House Rules Standing
Committee, sponsor by request, which is chaired by
Representative Coghill, presented the sectional analysis in HB
171.
JOHN BOUCHER, Senior Economist
Office of the Director
Office of Management & Budget (OMB)
Office of the Governor
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 171.
REPRESENTATIVE HARRY CRAWFORD
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Introduced HJR 6 as prime sponsor.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CHAIR BOB LYNN called the House State Affairs Standing Committee
meeting to order at 8:03:06 AM. Representatives Roses, Coghill,
Johansen, Johnson, and Lynn were present at the call to order.
Representatives Gruenberg and Doll arrived as the meeting was in
progress.
HJR 11-STATE'S CONTROL OF NATIONAL GUARD
8:03:50 AM
CHAIR LYNN announced that the first order of business was HOUSE
JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 11, Relating to the increased authority
granted to the President of the United States to federalize the
National Guard of the individual states without the consent of
the governors; and urging the United States Congress to take
action to restore the sovereignty of the individual states to
regulate and command the National Guard of the states.
8:04:23 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES, as prime sponsor of HJR 11, said the
proposed legislation is designed to emphasize to the U.S.
Congress the importance of state sovereignty in terms of
controlling the Alaska National Guard. He turned over
presentation of the resolution to his staff.
8:05:10 AM
JOSH APPLEBEE, Staff to Representative Bob Roses, Alaska State
Legislature, presented HJR 11 on behalf of Representative Roses,
prime sponsor. He stated that the 2007 Defense Authorization
Bill signed in to law by the President in October 2006 changed
the 200-year-old Insurrection Act. The change empowers the
President in future stateside emergencies, by allowing him/her
to deploy U.S. armed forces and federalize state Guard troops,
without consulting the governors within each state, in the event
of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health
emergency, terrorist attack, or incident. Mr. Applebee
indicated that the governors of all states and U.S. territories
have opposed the change. The proposed resolution asks that the
President consult with "the governors and the states before
taking over the National Guards."
8:06:16 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES indicated that there is a consensus that
the relationship between the armed forces and the National Guard
in Alaska is "a model to be used for every other state." If the
National Guard is busy, the Armed Forces will step in, and vice
versa. He stated there is no reason to change the practice of
complete cooperation that already exists, and he said he feels
strongly about HJR 11 and encourages everyone to support it.
8:07:32 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES, in response to a question from Chair Lynn,
said prior to [the 2007 Defense Authorization Bill], all that
was necessary in the case of an emergency or national disaster
was for the President simply to call the governor "and the
governor activates." He said he thinks [the 2007 Defense
Authorization Bill] was "a knee-jerk reaction" to the situation
surrounding Hurricane Katrina, and he said he doesn't think it
solves the problem.
8:09:37 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL expressed his appreciation for the
resolution.
8:10:24 AM
MR. APPLEBEE, in response to a question from Representative
Coghill, said the language in the resolution was patterned after
several letters sent from the National Governors' Association
(NGA) to U.S. Congress and the President of the United States.
8:10:52 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL expressed interest in strengthening the
language of the resolution. He directed attention to language
in the "FURTHER RESOLVED" portion of HJR 11, on page 2, lines
10-13, which read as follows:
FURTHER RESOLVED that the Alaska State
Legislature urges federal action to restore the
sovereignty of the individual states to regulate and
command National Guard troops during emergencies and
disasters, and to take whatever additional actions are
necessary to correct the encroachment of
constitutional authority to protect the citizens of
each state.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said states already have sovereignty
under the Tenth Amendment.
8:12:17 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL moved Amendment 1 as follows:
On page 2, line 11:
Delete "restore"
Insert "honor"
On page 2, line 12:
Between "whatever" and "actions"
Delete "additional"
CHAIR LYNN asked if there was any objection to Amendment 1.
There being none, it was so ordered.
8:12:53 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL asked if the President, as Commander in
Chief, has the power to override governors at any point.
MR. APPLEBEE responded that the President does not have that
power "at any point." He said the Insurrection Act of 1807
outlines the situations in which the President does have the
power to override the governors, in terms of federalizing the
National Guard. The 2007 Defense Authorization Bill gives the
President "additional powers within those confines."
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL asked, "Because it was domestic?"
MR. APPLEBEE answered that's correct.
8:13:44 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG directed attention to page 1, lines
[13-14], which read, "to recognize the militia's state role,"
and he suggested that that should be changed to "honor the
militia's state role".
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he thinks "recognize" is the right
word to use. He explained that he had proposed the change in
Amendment 1 because he didn't want to diminish the effect of the
language by leaving in the word "restore" on page 2, line 11.
8:14:34 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL moved to report HJR 11, as amended, out of
committee with individual recommendations [and the accompanying
fiscal notes]. There being no objection, CSHJR 11(STA) was
reported out of the House State Affairs Standing Committee.
The committee took an at-ease from 8:15:09 AM to 8:17:18 AM.
HB 171-ACCOMMODATE 90-DAY SESSION
8:17:25 AM
CHAIR LYNN announced that the next order of business was HOUSE
BILL NO. 171, "An Act relating to the terms of legislators, the
date and time for convening regular legislative sessions,
adoption of uniform rules of the legislature and to certain of
those rules, the date for organizing the Legislative Budget and
Audit Committee, and deadlines for certain matters or reports to
be delivered to the legislature or filed; prohibiting bonuses
for legislative employees; and providing for an effective date."
8:17:59 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL referred to a recently passed initiative,
which amends AS 24.05.150. He read the amended language as
follows:
The legislature shall adjourn from a regular session
within 90 consecutive calendar days, including the day
the legislature first convenes in that regular
session. This Act takes effect the first day of the
second regular session of the Twenty-Fifth
Legislature.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said the legislature needs to accommodate
the initiative. He said there are 23 sections in the bill, most
of which address "small movements of timeline issues." He said
there will be issues to consider, such as when to start the
session, and whether or not to impose a rule that would not
allow a bill to be carried into the second year of the session
if it has not passed the first body.
8:22:17 AM
RYNNIEVA MOSS, Staff to Representative John Coghill, Alaska
State Legislature, on behalf of the House Rules Standing
Committee, sponsor by request, which is chaired by
Representative Coghill, presented the sectional analysis in HB
171. She reviewed the sectional analysis for Section 1, which
read as follows:
Section 1. Public Safety annual report on
activities of the narcotic drug and alcohol
enforcement unit will be available the first day of
session. Currently it is to be made available within
30 days.
MS. MOSS directed attention to a chart included in the committee
packet that shows current and proposed dates for certain
deadlines.
8:24:28 AM
MS. MOSS turned to the sectional analysis for Section 2, which
read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 2. In odd numbered years Public Safety
submits their report on repeated child sexual abuse
arrests and criminal exploitation of children to
legislature on first day of session.
MS. MOSS reviewed the sectional analysis for Sections 3 through
5, which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 3. Changes the beginning of the term of
each member of the legislature to the second Monday of
February. (in Senate version).
Sec. 4. Starts session the second Monday of
February. (in Senate version).
Sec. 5. Expand the direction of the legislature
to adopt uniform rules at the beginning of each
session. Currently the legislature adopts uniform
rules in first legislative session.
MS. MOSS related that the change made by Section 5 may or may
not be a good idea. She explained that the "plus" is that the
adoption of uniform rules in joint session does not require a
two-thirds vote. However, a two-thirds vote is required in
order to amend the rules by concurrent resolution. She said
that is a policy call that the committee will have to make.
MS. MOSS reviewed the sectional analysis for Sections 6 and 7,
which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 6. Requires the department affected by a
piece of legislation to deliver to a requesting
legislative committee a fiscal note within three days
of the request. This is a change from five days and
th
after the 90 day two days.
Sec. 7. Extends the profile [sic] deadline from
January 1 to February 1.
MS. MOSS noted that the word "profile" should be "prefile". She
continued on to the sectional analysis for Section 8, which read
as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 8. Requires a bill introduced in the first
legislative session to be passed through its house of
origin in the first session to be considered in the
second session.
MS. MOSS said Section 8 would not preclude someone from
introducing a new bill in the second session. She reviewed the
sectional analysis for Sections 9 and 10, which read as follows,
[original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 9. Cleans up AS 24.10.220 and clarifies
legislative employees cannot be awarded bonuses.
Sec. 10. Requires the Legislative Budget & Audit
Committee to be organized within 10 days after the
convening of the legislature.
MS. MOSS noted that currently the Legislative Budget & Audit
Committee has 15 days to organize. She moved on to the
sectional analysis for Sections 11-13, which read as follows
[original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 11. Requires the Legislative Budget & Audit
Committee to prepare a report of investment programs,
plans, performance, and policies of all agencies of
the state that perform lending or investment functions
and notify the legislature of the report on or before
the first day of each regular session versus 30 days
after convening.
Sec. 12. Requires the LB & A to file with the
governor and the legislature its annual report
summarizing audit reports on or before the first day
of session versus within five days.
Sec. 13. Requires APOC to publish a directory of
registered lobbyists within 15 days after session
convenes. They now have 45 days.
MS. MOSS pointed out that with a session start date of February
5, and without the change made in Section 13, APOC's directory
of registered lobbyists would not be delivered until half way
through the session.
MS. MOSS reviewed the sectional analysis for Section 14, which
read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 14. Eliminates one of the disclosure reports for
contributions made to a civic league or organization
to influence activities of a legislature. The report
th
is currently due on February 10 which most likely
will be close to the first day of session.
MS. MOSS said Brooke Miles, the director of APOC, told her APOC
has not figured out a way to implement the current statute, and
she noted that there is an amendment in the committee packet,
upon the recommendation of Ms. Miles, which would repeal that
statute.
8:28:48 AM
MS. MILES reviewed the remaining portion of the sectional
analysis, covering Sections 15-23, which read as follows
[original punctuation provided]:
Sec. 15. This section gives the governor an extra 30
days to present to the legislature the annual
operating, capital, and mental health trust budget
th
bills. The deadline is moved from December 15 to
th
January 15.
Sec. 16. Moves the deadline for the governor's budget
workbook to the first Monday in February versus the
first Monday in January.
Sec.17. The governor's request for supplemental
appropriations must be provided to the legislature by
th
the fifth day of session versus 30 day and the
governor's budget amendments must be submitted by the
thth
15 day versus the 45 day.
Sec.18. Requires LB & A to prepare a report of
fees collected and recommended fee adjustments of
state agencies and provide it to the legislature by
the fifth day of session versus 30 days.
Sec.19. Requires DNR to give notice to the
legislature within five days from convening that a
report reflecting all money deposited to the State
Land Disposal Income Fund for the prior fiscal year is
th
available. They currently have until the 30 day.
Sec.20. Reduces from 30 to five days after
convening the deadline for DNR to submit a summary of
all "cooperative resource management or development
agreements" to the legislature.
Sec.21. Requires governor to submit to the
legislature within 15 days from convening the names of
persons appointed to a position or membership who have
not been confirmed by the legislature and persons to
be appointed to fill a position or membership for a
term that will expire on or before March 1 during that
session. Current provides for 30 days. It also
instructs the governor to immediately submit the name
of someone appointed after the first 15 days by while
the legislature is in regular session.
Sec.22. The term of office beginning on the
second Monday of February for a member of the
legislature first applies to legislators elected
during 2008.
Sec.23. This legislation has an effective date
of January 1, 2008.
8:32:07 AM
JOHN BOUCHER, Senior Economist, Office of the Director, Office
of Management & Budget (OMB), Office of the Governor, told the
committee that he is a policy analyst. He said OMB thinks that
the change in Section 15 is unnecessary. He said it is the
opinion of OMB that the December 15 budget is a preliminary one,
and that that version of the budget will inevitably be amended
by the statutory deadline. He said, "While it could be argued
that there's a potential benefit of having 30 extra days to
prepare or ... collect information for the December budget, it's
our assessment that it would be unlikely that this would prevent
an amended budget occurring." He continued:
Postponing the first budget submittal until January
15, while keeping the current deadline for the budget
amendments, significantly compresses the amount of
time available to prepare an amended budget from about
five to six weeks. If we kept the December 15 budget
deadline, we'd have about nine to ten weeks to prepare
that. And it's currently our assessment at this time
that we need that time.
MR. BOUCHER noted that many of the governor's appointees were
not "on board" by December 15. Furthermore, he said there are
statutory "and other" mechanisms currently in place to support
the December 15 deadline. He suggested OMB's preference would
be to have a couple years' experience using a regular budget
cycle with a later start date for a session, and then revisit
the issue as to January 15 would be a good budget deadline.
MR. BOUCHER concluded by noting that if all the budget-related
date changes are dependent upon moving the session back 30 days
- if the end result is a compressed time to prepare the budget -
than that would concern OMB.
8:35:37 AM
MR. BOUCHER, in response to a question from Chair Lynn regarding
a later start date for session, said he thinks the bill is
headed in the right direction because of the timing of the
revenue forecast. He said he thinks it would be ill-advised to
move the Spring forecast up 30 days. He stated, "... With the
price of oil the way it is, everyone would like the best
information ... possible." He said he thinks that's the reason
the revenue deadlines are set the way they currently are.
MR. BOUCHER, in response to Representative Coghill, offered his
understanding that the Spring forecast was timed to be closer to
the end of both the fiscal year and the session.
8:37:05 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said the House Special Committee on
Ways and Means is dealing with the issue shown in Section 16,
lines 9-14, which read as follows:
*Sec. 16. AS 37.07.040(7) is amended to read:
(7) provide the legislative finance
division with an advance copy of the governor's budget
workbooks by the first Monday in February [JANUARY] of
each year [, EXCEPT THAT FOLLOWING A GUBERNATORIAL
ELECTION YEAR THE ADVANCE COPY SHALL BE PROVIDED BY
THE SECOND MONDAY IN JANUARY];
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG asked Mr. Boucher if he thinks the
language to be deleted on lines 12-14 would affect the ability
of a new administration to prepare an adequate budget.
8:39:25 AM
MR. BOUCHER responded:
If we do keep the December 15 deadline, then I think
... [paragraph] (7) could more or less stay intact -
it would not need to be amended - because we would
have the budget in place and we could provide that.
... Going back to what I said previously: Whether the
budget deadline is December 15 or January 15, I think
a new administration is handicapped under either
scenario. And I do believe that the best result is to
give the new administration adequate time to prepare
an amended budget, rather than coming in [and] having
to do a quick budget, so to speak, to meet a deadline,
and potentially having expectations set higher because
... it is supposedly their budget.
8:41:42 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG asked Ms. Moss if the various sections
in the bill that will affect different departments have been
"vetted with those departments."
8:42:08 AM
MS. MOSS said that has not been done with every single
department. However, she said the sponsor worked with the
Legislative Liaison Office. She pointed out that there is "a
zero fiscal note from all departments."
8:43:01 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL, regarding Section 3, posited that
starting session on the second Monday in February would give the
legislature time to "do a little bit of discovery," move the
session closer to the spring forecast, and put the session into
more months with typically better weather. He said the big
question is whether or not the legislature wants to have its
elected officials in limbo from November to February.
8:44:18 AM
CHAIR LYNN said this is a matter that concerns him. He
explained that the person newly elected in November cannot do
anything until February, while the legislator on his/her way out
is a lame duck in November and December.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL interjected, "But still [authoritative]."
CHAIR LYNN concurred.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said Representative Roses had brought up
the possibility of calling into special session those who are
the lame ducks. He added, "It gives you a month for a possible
scenario where you could put those who have been elected by
their ... citizenry to be ineffective under some scenarios."
CHAIR LYNN remarked that being called into a special session
after every election, but before the new session, would mean the
legislature ends up meeting for 120 days. He indicated that
there has been precedent on this.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL noted that legislators cannot be sworn in
until they have convened.
8:46:12 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES pointed out that the initiative clearly
states that the 90 days must be consecutive. He said that is
unfortunate, because without that stipulation the legislature
could convene in January and take a break in the middle, which
would allow time during the annual Energy Council and Easter
break. He said that is the unfortunate part of initiatives. He
explained, "Part of doing a bill is that you have these
discussions and you can vet out the unintended consequences.
But the voters have spoken, and it appears we have to ... at
least abide by what's there." He stated that it doesn't matter
to him when the legislature convenes, as long as it gets its
work done.
8:47:51 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said according to statute, the term of
a Representative is two years and the term of a Senator is four
years. He deduced:
The Twenty-Fifth [Alaska] State Legislature will ...
be out of office on the third Monday in January in
2009. The Twenty-Sixth [Alaska State] Legislature
won't convene until the second Monday in February.
That leaves the state without a legislature for
several weeks, and I think that that violates ...
Article 2, Section 3.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he would like the director of
Legislative Legal and Research Services, Tamara Cook, to review
the matter.
8:49:12 AM
MS. MOSS proffered, "That same section of the constitution says
that their terms begin on the fourth Monday of January following
the election, unless otherwise provided by law, so that can be
fixed by statute."
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG responded that it is not a question of
when the term begins, but rather the amount of time legislators
are in office. He specified that there would be a gap between
the middle of January through the middle of February.
8:50:12 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked if it would be possible to swear in
legislators on January 2 and wait to convene session until
February. In response to a comment by Chair Lynn, he said
judges swear people in all the time. He said that idea would at
least cover a special session if it were called January 1.
8:51:15 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN expressed appreciation for
Representative Gruenberg's comments. He agreed that there can
be problems implementing citizen initiatives, which he said is
"exactly why we're capable of amending" them. He emphasized how
concerned he is about the lag time between legislators being
elected, sworn in, and the start of session. He said he is
familiar with what it feels like to sit around and wait, because
he was elected in the primary and had nobody running against him
in the general election.
8:52:41 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG, regarding Representative Johnson's
comment about swearing legislators in early, said doing so can
be unconstitutional because there would end up being two
different groups of legislators in office simultaneously.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON explained that he had used January 1 as
an example, but it could be another date certain that worked
out.
8:53:43 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL noted that the Alaska State Constitution
stipulates that the legislature shall convene every year; it
only gives the authority to change the day and the month. He
said he was referring to Article 2, Section 8. He said, "You
cannot have officers [and] you cannot swear anybody in until
you've actually convened." He said he would task his staff to
get an opinion from Tamara Cook on the issue. At this point, it
is expected that incoming legislators will be sworn in on the
fourth Monday in January, and most [outgoing] legislators would
expect that their term would end at that point, unless otherwise
notified.
CHAIR LYNN thanked Representative Gruenberg for bringing the
issue to the everyone's attention.
8:56:31 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said the bill has urgency, because the
legislature must make plans this year to be ready for what it
must do next year. It is, however, not as easy as it looks to
do so, and there are constitutional issues involved. He cited
[the last sentence of] Article 2, Section 8 of the Alaska State
Constitution, which read:
The legislature shall adopt as part of the uniform
rules of procedure deadlines for scheduling session
work not inconsistent with provisions controlling the
length of the session.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he does not know if the
legislature must change any of its uniform rules to meet that
constitutional question. He recommended looking at the entire
bill to see if there are any constitutional issues that need to
be addressed.
8:58:19 AM
CHAIR LYNN asked if those issues should be searched for by the
House Judiciary Standing Committee.
8:58:35 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG suggested that the House State Affairs
Standing Committee do the work.
CHAIR LYNN concurred.
8:59:13 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES suggested the bill may need work by a
subcommittee.
CHAIR LYNN said he would not be opposed to that idea.
8:59:56 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL concurred with [Representative Rose's
suggestion to form a subcommittee].
9:00:23 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he does not think a subcommittee is
necessary. He named the policy calls the committee must make:
the date session should start and whether or not a bill should
die if it doesn't pass the first house. The other issues, he
said, will fall into place. At this point, he said, the only
Uniform Rules change that he anticipates would be in relation to
notification of bills. He recommended working through one 90-
day session first to "see where the tension lies." He said
another issue to consider is how many days to give the governor
to bring an amended budget to the legislature, and he
recommended 30.
9:03:00 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said Representative Roses' suggestion
to form a subcommittee may be good idea. However, he proposed
an alternative to that idea would be to schedule extra time for
the full committee to address the bill.
CHAIR LYNN indicated that the public, as well as legislators,
will be affected by a 90-day session.
9:04:30 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL reviewed some of the questions that the
committee needed to address, including focusing on the time
between election and being sworn in and what would happen if a
special session were to be called. He reiterated that he would
get a legal opinion.
9:05:12 AM
CHAIR LYNN said he would hold comment on Section 3 for the
moment.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG stated that he hopes Chair Lynn will be
receptive to amendments on all parts of the bill, even if the
committee moves forward with its study of it.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG, in relation to Section 4 of the bill,
cited Article 2, [Section 8], which read as follows [original
punctuation provided]:
SECTION 8. Regular Sessions.The legislature shall
convene in regular session each year on the fourth
Monday in January, but the month and day may be
changed by law. The legislature shall adjourn from
regular session no later than one hundred twenty
consecutive calendar days from the date it convenes
except that a regular session may be extended once for
up to ten consecutive calendar days. An extension of
the regular session requires the affirmative vote of
at least two-thirds of the membership of each house of
the legislature. The legislature shall adopt as part
of the uniform rules of procedure deadlines for
scheduling session work not inconsistent with
provisions controlling the length of the session.
9:07:16 AM
CHAIR LYNN directed attention to Section 5.
9:07:28 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he does not see any redeeming value
in Section 5 at this point.
9:08:07 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL moved to adopt Amendment 1, as follows:
On page 3, lines 3-8:
Delete all material
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he does not recall the legislature
having adopted the Uniform Rules, and he suggested that a motion
needed to be made on the [House] floor.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL responded, "I've made the motion this
year, and every year, at the beginning of the convening of each
session, it is made."
9:09:07 AM
CHAIR LYNN [asked if there was any objection] to Amendment 1.
There being none, it was so ordered.
9:09:35 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he thinks Section 6 is necessary.
He recommended that discussion on Section 7 be held until the
policy call is made on when to start the session.
CHAIR LYNN opened discussion on Section 8.
9:10:31 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL moved to adopt Amendment 2, which read as
follows [original punctuation provided]:
Page 4, lines 6-10:
Delete all material
There being no objection, Amendment 2 was adopted.
9:11:06 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL spoke in support of Sections 9 and 10 of
the bill.
CHAIR LYNN ascertained that the committee had no issue with
Sections 11-13.
9:12:54 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL reminded the committee that Ms. Miles had
suggested the need to amend Section 14. He mentioned [Amendment
3], which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Page 6, lines 11-20:
Delete all material
Page 9, line 9, after the words "Sec.23.":
Insert:
AS24.45.116 is repealed.
Renumbered "This Act takes effect January 1, 2008." as
Sec.24.
9:13:23 AM
MS. MOSS reiterated her explanation regarding the practices of
APOC in relation to Section 14.
9:14:00 AM
[Amendment 3 was treated as moved for adoption.]
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he does not have any problem with
Amendment 3, except for the language on the sixth line of the
amendment, which "deals with the repealer of the current AS
24.45.116." He said that is substantive.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he would like to see the language
"AS 24.45.116 is repealed." removed from Amendment 3.
9:14:37 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he would have no objection to that.
MS. MOSS commented that to be clear, lines [4] through 7 [as
numbered on Amendment 3] should be deleted.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved [to adopt Amendment 1 to
Amendment 3, to delete lines 4 through 7, as numbered on
Amendment 3].
[Amendment 1 to Amendment 3 was treated as adopted.]
9:15:51 AM
CHAIR LYNN asked if there was any objection to Amendment 3, as
amended. There being none, it was so ordered. The adopted
Amendment 3, as amended, read thus [original punctuation
provided]:
Page 6, lines 11-20:
Delete all material
9:16:22 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL, regarding Section 15, said the earlier
the administration can put together the budget, the better for
all concerned.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL moved to adopt Amendment 4 to delete
Section 15 from the bill.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG recollected that Mr. Boucher had
suggested that both Sections 15 and 16 be deleted.
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he would like any motion to delete
Section 16 to be made separately, because he said he thinks
"they are separate discussions." He explained that Section 16
would be affected by the as yet undecided start date of the
legislature, thus discussion of it should be delayed.
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG concurred.
CHAIR LYNN said, "So, we'll leave that go for now." He
ascertained that the committee had no issue with Sections 17 and
18.
9:18:35 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said Section 19 would be affected by the
start date of session. He stated support of Section 20, which
he said would not be affected by the start date. He said that
although Section 21 may be affected by the start date, he
supports requiring the governor to present appointees names as
soon as possible and hopes that the governor would agree with
the 15-day deadline proposed in that section. He indicated that
Section 22 would encompass the previously discussed issue
regarding the legality of shifting dates between one legislature
and another.
9:20:41 AM
REPRESENTATIVE LYNN said he thinks Section 23, relating to the
effective date of the bill, needs to remain in the bill.
9:20:54 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he will have a committee substitute
drafted as soon as possible and procure the previously mentioned
legal opinion.
9:21:36 AM
MS. MOSS, returning to a prior question asked by Representative
Johnson, stated that the rule related to convening and swearing
in is Rule Number One of Uniform Rules.
[HB 171 was heard and held.]
HJR 6-CONST. AM: ELECTED ATTORNEY GENERAL
9:21:54 AM
CHAIR LYNN announced that the last order of business was HOUSE
JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 6, Proposing amendments to the Constitution
of the State of Alaska relating to the office of attorney
general.
The committee took an at-ease from 9:22:20 AM to 9:23:18 AM.
9:23:34 AM
REPRESENTATIVE HARRY CRAWFORD, Alaska State Legislature,
introduced HJR 6 as prime sponsor. He stated that he does not
take making changes to the constitution of the state lightly.
He proposed that HJR 6 is based upon the philosophical question
of whether or not the attorney general of the state should be
the governor's lawyer or the people's top lawyer. He stated his
belief that the attorney general should be the top [arbiter] of
law in the state for the people. He related that there have
been attorneys general whose opinions match that of the
governor. Furthermore, he said, there have been times when the
same attorney general has served more than one governor and has
still changed his/her opinion to match that of the governor.
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD reported that 43 of the United States
have elected attorneys general, 5 states have appointed ones,
and the supreme court of Maine and Tennessee elect their
attorneys general. He stated his belief that the people should
have the right to decide who their attorney general should be.
9:26:13 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD, in response to Chair Lynn, indicated
that if HJR 6 were to pass, the governor would still turn to the
attorney general for advice. If the governor's and attorney
general's philosophies differ, he said, the Alaska Supreme Court
would be the final [arbiter]. He stated his belief that a
governor will be more honest in the policies he/she puts forth
when he/she has to get an opinion from an attorney general that
is not beholden to them.
9:28:12 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked if any states have a system wherein
they have two elected attorney generals - one Republican and one
Democrat - and when the governor is elected, the attorney
general from the political party matching that of the governor
gets the position.
9:28:52 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD offered his understanding that that
practice has been made illegal.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON said he likes the idea of having an
elected attorney general, but would like to keep the
philosophical bent the same to avoid law suits between a
governor and attorney general who are constantly at odds with
each other.
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he would like to see some tension
between the attorney general and the governor; he would not like
to see them in lockstep.
CHAIR LYNN remarked, "Nor would we want to see them opposed on
every issue in the book."
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he wouldn't want that to happen
either. He stated, "An office holder is only as good as that
person. I don't know how we set up a system that weeds out
people that are just completely partisan for partisan's sake."
9:30:53 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES said human error is the same whether made
by an appointed attorney general or an elected one. He said he
will need more convincing as to how an elected attorney general
would serve in a better capacity than one appointed. He stated,
"An election is won by somebody that does a better job of
campaigning than somebody else; it doesn't necessarily mean
they're going to be better at the job."
9:32:22 AM
CHAIR LYNN said if he were governor, he would want an attorney
general who was in his "same philosophical ball park."
9:32:46 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES said he thinks electing an attorney general
makes the situation more political, not less.
9:33:02 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said if he made that statement, he had
not meant to. He clarified that the attorney general would be
the people's representative and answerable "more to the people
than just to the governor." Currently, the AG is answerable to
the governor and can be fired at any moment if he/she doesn't
answer to the governor. He said he knows it will be an uphill
battle to change the constitution, with a required two-thirds
majority vote of the legislature and a popular vote of the
people. In response to a question from Representative Roses, he
said to his knowledge there has never been a time when the
legislature has failed to confirm an attorney general brought
forward by the governor. He said it could happen, and under
such circumstances "we give the governor his cabinet or her
cabinet, whichever the case may be."
CHAIR LYNN said, "Well, we do have to confirm it. We're just
going through this process now, so we don't have to confirm."
9:35:55 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL stated that the reason to have an
appointed attorney general is to give our executive branch as
much authority as is practically possible. He said when Alaska
became a state, it had to petition federal government to control
its state issues, and so, the thinking was there was a need for
a strong executive branch in order to impose the state's views.
The trade-off was that the attorney general was not accountable
to the people. He suggested there are two questions to ask:
Whether it has been effective to amalgamate that power in the
executive branch; and whether or not the people have been served
well. He said he does not know that the people have been ill-
served; however, he said he is not convinced that "our authority
has been well exerted from the executive branch." He said he
can think of one time when there was misuse of authority such
that he had thought at the time that the attorney general should
be elected. He asked Representative Crawford to convince him of
the need for HJR 6.
9:39:18 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he thought long and hard about
examples he could bring to the committee; however, the problem
is that examples that he thinks show that the state has been
totally ill-served may be viewed by others as an example of the
state having been well served. He restated his belief that an
attorney general popularly elected is more accountable to the
people.
9:41:15 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said the people of Alaska need to be able
to voice their complaints.
9:42:14 AM
CHAIR LYNN asked Representative Crawford if his arguments would
also apply to the United States Supreme Court. In response to
Representative Crawford, he clarified that there is a need to
take politics "out of it" as much as possible, but those who are
elected have to campaign. He questioned whether politics would
affect the decision that an elected attorney general would give
to the governor or the people.
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said the 43 states that elect their
attorneys general seem to be satisfied with that method. He
stated that politics is just something that must be dealt with
on a daily basis, and he related his belief that an attorney
general could deal with the same politics that legislators do.
He said there are many people qualified to be an attorney
general that may never get appointed by a governor because they
might be too independent. In response to Chair Lynn, he said he
believes the state superintendent of education should be an
elected position, but he said that is another discussion to be
held at a later date.
9:46:03 AM
REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said he would get copies of the minutes
from the original Alaska Constitutional Convention to share with
the committee.
9:46:20 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL said she thinks HJR 6 is a good issue to
address. She asked if the attorneys general that run for
election in the various 43 states run on party lines.
9:46:46 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said attorneys general in those states
don't have to politicize their campaigns, but they can if they
wish. In response to a follow-up question from Representative
Doll, he said the proposed resolution would set up a four-year
term for each attorney general. He said he has requested an
amendment to set a two-term limit, the same as that of the
governor. The attorney general could sit out for a term after
two consecutive terms and then once again be eligible to run.
9:48:30 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG directed attention to page 1, line 10,
of HJR 6, which proposes to delete "[SECRETARY OF STATE]" and
replace it with "lieutenant governor". He said he is wondering
if that needs to be done in other parts of the constitution.
Representative Gruenberg stated that an important question to
ask is: "Whom does the attorney general represent? Does the
attorney general represent the governor or the best interest of
the state, of people, whoever?" He said the answer to that
question is key to deciding whether or not to adopt HJR 6. He
suggested that the Alaska Bar Association look at that question.
He explained, "Because it's axiomatic in the profession; you
can't represent two clients." He offered an example. If the
legislature were to decide that there is a conflict, he said, it
should pass a specific statute addressing the ethical
responsibilities of the attorney general. He mentioned other
questions, such as who should make the decision whether or not
to litigate or appeal and what the guidelines should be. He
said, "... I think this puts the legislature squarely in the
role of making that decision, and I would like this committee to
consider carefully whether there is a conflict of interest and,
if so, how do we best deal with it?"
9:54:36 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD responded:
I believe that Representative Gruenberg has ... hit
the nail squarely on the head as to what the problem
is. ... I perceive there to be a conflict of
interest: Whenever the attorney general owes his
position to the governor and can be fired at any
moment at the pleasure of the governor, then I believe
that they are more accountable to the governor than
they are to the people and good law.
As far as having the bar association look at this, I
don't see where their authority to look at this comes
from. I believe that this is a question for the
legislature and the general public to decide.
I believe that there is an inherent conflict the way
it's set up today, and I believe that although it
doesn't guarantee that you'll get a good attorney
general every time, what it does guarantee is that you
get an independent attorney general.
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD, regarding the idea that the office of
attorney general may be politicized and used as a stepping stone
to run for governor or United States Senator or Representative,
offered examples of that happening.
9:57:24 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES said he agrees with much of what
Representative Gruenberg said, with the exception of getting the
opinion of the Alaska Bar Association. In terms of addressing
some of the conflicts, he said he thinks that needs to be done
whether the attorney general is elected or appointed. One
conflict, he suggested, may be the need for an elected attorney
general to run for re-election while still serving office. He
said there may be a potential for ethical conflicts. He said,
"We have a confirmation process, and if I'm not mistaken do we
not also have a process where if we think somebody's doing a
pretty poor job that we could work towards removing them from
that office?"
9:59:10 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he would leave it up to the
committee's wisdom to determine whether to impose term limits in
a way that would not make it necessary for the attorney general
to campaign while in office. He said, "The way it's set up
right now, the attorney general can be the governor's flunky.
I'm not saying that's happened."
10:00:19 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES said the Alaska State Constitution very
deliberately gives a tremendous amount of power to the governor.
He said he is not certain any other state has done the same. He
said he thinks the founding fathers made the right decision.
CHAIR LYNN questioned whether HJR 6, in combination with the
upcoming change to a 90-day session would give extra power to
the governor.
10:01:12 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he believes Alaska has outgrown the
need for "super powerful governorship." He said he believes in
giving more power to the people.
10:02:29 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DOLL said she is impressed that 43 states "found
this very important and have put it into effect." She asked how
much such an election would cost.
10:02:55 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he would have to get back to
Representative Doll with that information. He noted that an
election for attorney general would not be held outside other
elections, thus "it would be partly borne in the cost of the
other elections that are being held at the same time."
10:03:39 AM
CHAIR LYNN announced that HJR 6 was heard and held.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
State Affairs Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at
10:04:25 AM.
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